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Everything posted by sundayschool

  1. This thread is gross, and some of the posters here should be ashamed of themselves for propagating sexist nonsense that no educated Muslim should be spouting. Came back here after a long time to see what's going on and probably won't be returning. The Prophet has spoken highly of women. If women are so inferior at logical thinking, why do we rely on Aisha for most of the Hadith? There are REAL CULTURAL reasons why women tend to work less hours and forgo opportunities in computer science. Women are told from birth that their careers are less important and they need to be responsible for child-rearing. Hence why women pick less demanding careers. I'm astonished by how illogical and frankly idiotic the arguments are on here. The best part is all the guys that are patting themselves on the back for being so intelligent. Oh, also, since you're posting all these statistics on how men must be smarter because they are chess players, please explain the whole inferiority thing in regards to women having higher college graduation rates worldwide? Your thinking is backwards and brings a bad name to Islam. This is why the perception of Islam so often is that its backwards and sexist, despite all the reforms the Prophet introduced for women. This thread just makes me so angry. I feel so bad for Muslim women, that we have to put up with this kind of garbage. We deserve better.
  2. sundayschool

    Question Thread

    When should children begin fasting? I know the general rule of thumb is when they hit puberty, but I feel like that isn't the full story. Some kids hit puberty at age 7, and others at age 15. I personally feel that someone at 15 should be fasting whether or not they've hit puberty. It's about mental development, too, isn't it, not just sexual maturity? I was having this discussion with my mom because I found it ridiculous that she was excusing a 15 year old from fasting because he hasn't really hit puberty yet...whereas some really little kids have to start very early just because they hit puberty young!
  3. sundayschool

    Fiqh of Facebook

    No doubt it's important to address the issue of online communication, but these articles do so in a very silly way and without actually addressing the main problem. With all of the bullying that's been taking place, especially over online relationships, it's so important to discuss safety, who you should trust, proper interaction, etc. People are not poking others on FB for fun (is that even a thing? because all these articles keep talking about the fitnah of poking when I don't actually think it happens all that often), they are doing it because they are lonely and it is easy to find people online, trust them, and have some sort of relationship. I am especially concerned for those that are younger, because they often are the most vulnerable, and it is very easy to be fooled by an older predator who you think is trustworthy but is just trying to take advantage of you. Why not address the roots of this? Why do so many teenagers feel lonely? Why are fathers so often absent/aloof that young girls feel compelled to seek out validation from other men? That's the real discussion to be having.
  4. sundayschool

    My Beliefs Blog

    There have always been Muslims who drank and engaged in extramarital sex! There has always been a group of people, especially elites, across Muslim empires (just read history) who have had dancers and mistresses and written poetry about wine. This really isn't anything new and I don't know why we bother to discuss these things so much. Islam is pretty clear on where it stands on alcohol and sex. People who don't want to follow those rules just won't follow them. They still believe in Islam, so they don't want to renounce the religion and therefore try to justify their actions in silly ways. It's not ideal but it's not this new revolution that's happening, either. Has the author of this article spent anytime looking at the way Muslims are treating the disadvantaged? Domestic violence victims, servants, the disabled, the poor? Or will they only pontificate on things that they can feel self-righteous about?
  5. sundayschool

    UAE: Land of no-tax and other questions

    I was explaining that UAE doesn't tax its citizens, so therefore the citizens don't have many political rights! What's so wrong about that? You basically agreed with me a few posts ago.
  6. sundayschool

    London Summer Olympics 2012

    Ooooh thanks for clarifying, that makes more sense. So they'd have to push it 2-4 weeks back (can't remember when it started). That would have been a lot better. They certainly couldn't have changed it last minute for the Muslim athletes (i.e. this year), because so much planning goes into it. However, I wonder when they decided the dates and when exactly the Muslim countries petitioned them to change it. If they petitioned this year, it makes sense that they couldn't accommodate them, and it would have been very shortsighted on the Muslim countries' part not to realize that Ramadan would fall during the games sooner. The example you brought up with the Christian athletes really isn't the same, then, though. It's one thing to delay one event from a Sunday to a Monday, and an altogether different undertaking to push the games back a few weeks. No way would this have happened unless someone raised a concern when they were actually deciding on the dates. Sorry, I didn't mean to come across as censoring the discussion. Of course we should talk about this, but in a way that doesn't pass judgment on the athletes. I was just concerned because some posts said things like "it makes it clear where their priorities lie," and I thought that was crossing a line. Saying that people's priorities lie elsewhere is basically saying that they don't care about being a good Muslim, which I'm sure you would agree isn't right.
  7. sundayschool

    London Summer Olympics 2012

    Fasts don't end til well into the evening/night, and many of the events have to be held in the daylight. I'm just asking to clarify your post - when could they move the events to, then? Do you remember what sports the athletes in '96 were competing in? I didn't know that such a thing had happened, and I'd love to know more. Also, there are a bunch of Muslims fasting - Mohamed-Khaled Belabbas, Noor al-Malki, and there was definitely someone from Britain, if I remember correctly. Oh, and apparently the Islamic Human Rights Commission and other countries like Turkey and Morocco had lobbied for a schedule change, but the Olympic Committee refused to do it. Also, one of the fatwas issued about the fasting didn't say that it was OK for the athletes to postpone their fasts because they were playing in the Olympics, it was that they could delay them since they were travelling, which has clear Islamic basis. I just think we should steer clear of judging people. It's unfortunate that the games had to fall during Ramadan, but no one's Iman is perfect, and you can never really know what other people are going through.
  8. sundayschool

    UAE: Land of no-tax and other questions

    I'm unsure of why you're getting so defensive, because I wasn't even very critical of the UAE in my post. I was mostly explaining how the government works there. In terms of rights - not having freedom of speech or press to criticize the government is actually HUGE. You didn't really "prove" what was wrong with my post, and I'm disappointed that you haven't bothered to respond to the rest of it, because I was actually looking forward to learning more. But I guess there's not much for us to discuss now, is there? There was a full-fledged discussion going on about the UAE before I even made my post, so I completely disagree that I was making an unrelated comment to a throw-away remark about taxation. There is plenty of criticism of other countries on these boards. I find it funny that people who so casually criticize the West are getting unreasonably defensive about Middle Eastern countries. They have to grow a tough skin. No one's country is perfect and you have to be able to deal with criticism civilly. Of course the UAE is light years ahead of Saudi Arabia. That doesn't mean there isn't room for growth. If laborers are treated badly, then that should be brought up again and again until it is addressed. Regarding the Arab Spring, I know that Saudi Arabia immediately increased allowances for college students (not sure about others, but this I know for sure) at the first sign of unrest in the other countries. You are right that the majority are happy with their lives, but there are sizable minorities in these places that are incredibly unhappy. Military action such as that in Bahrain + throwing money at people can only work for so long in dealing with their grievances.
  9. sundayschool

    UAE: Land of no-tax and other questions

    Um, what did I say that was incorrect? First of all, I'm not basing my claims on what the "stupid western media" (which, by the way, couldn't care less about the UAE. They're only interested in the buildings. And I think it's a insulting to dismiss Western intellectuals completely like that). I've studied the Gulf states academically. My post was based in political fact. It's called "rentier state theory." A popular slogan during the American Revolution was "no taxation without representation" - the American colonists were being taxed by Britain despite having unsatisfactory representation in Parliament. In rentier states, the logic is, "we're not taxing you at all, so why would you want any representation?" I really did not say anything about the UAE that was one-sided (like your defense in this thread is turning out to be). This is a complex situation. It's great that the UAE can help its citizens with things like college education. But you can't deny that there is something problematic about citizens having no political autonomy at all. I mean, even the UAE government has recognized this and is trying to introduce reforms that get the public politically involved (or so they say, at the very least). What you're saying about the foreign laborers is just incorrect. If you have any articles or research to share that backs up your claims, I would love to read it. I'm not being sarcastic - I genuinely would like to learn more. I have some sources if you'd like to take a look - http://www.hrw.org/world-report-2012/world-report-2012-united-arab-emirates http://www.hhrjournal.org/index.php/hhr/article/view/435/665 Hmm, I don't think the Arab Spring didn't spread to the Gulf States because everyone is content (first, you'd have to define what you mean by "the people.") Remember that these countries have powerful militaries, and since they literally own everything, it's harder for citizens to protest. The international community is also more likely to help these countries defend themselves against protests, because they don't want anything to interfere with their oil supply. Just look at the brutal suppression that happened in Bahrain, which was assisted by Saudi Arabia. How long will that money last? It comes from their natural resource, oil, which isn't exactly renewable. Look, as I said in my response to M5er - it's absurd to say that you're perfectly fine with no political rights, as long as the cash supply is coming in. That's called selling your soul. What happens when the leaders end up being corrupt or make bad decisions? Too bad, you can't do anything, because you have no rights! It is a crime in the UAE to criticize the government and many critics have been detained and harassed. I understand that not everyone wants to live in a Western-style democracy. But there must be some sort of political autonomy everywhere. The issue is not democracy, but whether citizens have any political autonomy at all.
  10. sundayschool

    UAE: Land of no-tax and other questions

    Regarding the Gulf States - first of all, the money only goes to the tiny minority of citizens in those countries, all the foreigners who do the domestic labor can just die for all anyone cares. Also, the money is given to placate the citizens because they literally have no rights at all. The reason behind not taxing them is that if the citizens are not paying taxes and instead getting money from the government, they have no right to anything politically.
  11. sundayschool

    London Summer Olympics 2012

    Bahahaha I love you guys: London Mayor Celebrates First British Gold by Getting Stuck on Zip Line as Crowd Laughs London Dangling Mayor Becomes Latest Delightful British Meme
  12. sundayschool

    London Summer Olympics 2012

    Brits, you guys have won four medals so far. Four. Four! I'm embarrassed for you guys!
  13. sundayschool

    London Summer Olympics 2012

    Their outfits could not have been uglier! I've seen my fellow Pakistanis bling themselves out for the smallest tea gathering at someone's house, and yet for the Olympics they looked like they were wearing their old house clothes.
  14. sundayschool

    MM Questions

    I spent some time googling your problem to see if I could help in some way. Unfortunately, couldn't find anything that made sense. If there are particular PMs you're looking for, though, maybe you can ask people to send them again if they still have them in their sent boxes? For people that have MM, maybe the mods can help you out by finding their PMs. Good luck! I'm a very nostalgic and sentimental person myself, so I can imagine how you feel.
  15. sundayschool

    My Brother the Islamist

    I absolutely agree with Lady. Read the posts in this thread - most of them acknowledged that he was wrong, but felt that he would eventually figure out what's right, and he should be given a grace period as he is a convert. You give people a grace period for things like eating candy with gelatin in it. You should never excuse intolerance, even for a second. This guy thought that he should only use his "bathroom hand" to shake hands with non Muslims. That is incredibly hateful, and I'm surprised that someone would even convert to a religion where this was considered acceptable. I include myself in this of course...but I think as a community we often fail on where to correct people. We look the other way or assume that it wil get better - when it never does - in cases of intolerance, domestic violence, etc, and yet we're so eager to always tell people that when they're praying they're not standing up straight enough or other nonsense like that. As for the Daily Telegraph, if someone is arrested for a crime (especially relating to terrorism), and they were once on TV/in a film/in an article, that's newsworthy and it's going to get covered.
  16. sundayschool

    My Brother the Islamist

    I don't quite understand your comment. The Telegraph editor of course would report this story, it's extremely newsworthy. The bad guys in this story are the terrorists plotting to kill innocent people and terrorize others, not the journalists reporting on them.
  17. sundayschool


    So I feel like we discuss motherhood all the time, particularly during pointless freakout sessions over feminism (which, IMO, is not really an issue in the Muslim community). I don't understand it because people panic that working moms won't take care of their kids. I've seen lots of working moms with high-powered careers who are also really great and devoted mothers (some more so than stay-at-home moms). After you carry a kid around for 9 months and give birth to him/her, honestly, you have no choice but to fall in love with the child and make it your first priority. Moms that would neglect their kids while working would probably neglect their kids as stay-at-home moms, too, because they're just cold and aloof by personality. Getting way off track here. My point was that we don't discuss fatherhood enough, and a good dad is really integral to a child's development, too! Being a good dad is not just about paying the bills, it also involves nurturing and bonding with your child. I feel like many guys in our generation don't have the best role models - often our fathers who grew up back home (or even in the West, really, there are huge fatherhood problems) were not the most nurturing people. They cared, but didn't always know how to express it. So what makes a good dad? I'll start by contributing my own advice. The relationship should primarily be based on respect and trust, not fear. Do not make your kids feel ashamed of themselves. Them going through puberty might freak you out, but they're even more confused, and you want your kids to be healthy and confident. Be the dad that a daughter can come home to and say "hey, dad, that guy in class is really bothering me, what should I do about it?" Don't be the dad that she is too ashamed to even bring it up to because it'll call attention to her maturity.
  18. sundayschool

    Satyamev Jayate - Victory In Truth show

    So I'm super late in responding to this, but I hope that's okay! I think giving Bollywood the main, or even a chunk of, the responsibility for suicide is a bit simplistic. I agree that perhaps Bollywood has an impact on other dramatic steps, such as eloping, or being a drama queen in general, but suicide is just so drastic. People who kill themselves aren't in the right frame of mind. They feel that they have nothing to lose and that life will never get any better. This is not a result of Bollywood but a result of their circumstances. I've studied women's issues in India, and I think to assign culpability to Bollywood does a disservice to these women. These women often kill themselves because they don't have anywhere to turn to. Dowry demands are often accompanied by violence and abuse, not just from the husband, but the his parents and siblings as well. If she goes home, her parents will tell her to go back to her husband. If she goes to the police, they will do nothing. If she goes to her husband, she will be humiliated and hit on a daily basis. There are no shelters for her to run to, no resources for her to access, and if she decides to just wing it and run away, she will probably end up either having to go into prostitution because she has no choice, or being abducted/abused/sold into sex slavery. When you have options like that, is it really all that surprising that you'd rather die? And do you really need Bollywood to push yourself over the edge? In fact, I'd even go as far to say that wholesome Bollywood movies can even serve a beneficial purpose in that they provide people with some degree of escapism.
  19. sundayschool

    Marriage at a young age.

    At least in the West, I'd say no to early teens. There is a longer concept of childhood here, and you can't even financially support yourself at that age because you're too young. It's fine if you have parents that can help, but in my opinion, you need to be able to work just in case things go wrong. Personally, I'm such a different person from when I was in my teens. So much more mature. If I had gotten married when I was younger, I think there would have been a lot of pointless over-emotionalness and drama ("you didn't call me in the past two hours...you dont love me!" *storms off to room dramatically*). Basically, all the stuff my parents had to deal with, my husband would have (and I'm sure he would have had his own teenage emo annoying phase), and honestly, no one other than your parents can deal with that on a daily basis. I say this as a teenager who had actually been pretty mature compared to her peers. But at that age, your brain is still developing and you're never as smart as you think you are. Basically, if you still need mom and dad to legally sign off on your paperwork, you're too young!
  20. Remember the two stories (also posted on MM) about the cleric who gave a fatwa about how women shouldn't eat "phallic" foods, and another about how the Egyptian parliament was debating a law about husbands having sex with their dead wives? Remember how they both turned out to be false, but they still went viral? Here's a good article on that topic: http://jezebel.com/5910590/why-the-obsession-with-muslims-and-sex
  21. sundayschool

    Why the Obsession with Muslims and Sex?

    Really? She's arguing that the West has a fascination with sex and Muslims, and she attributes this to orientalism. Then she says that you can't use statistics such as those on Google searching to portray Muslims as sexually repressed, because that has more to do with culture. "This isn't just about a fascination with the perversions of nutty and misogynistic spiritual leaders —- it is also deeply tied to an age old obsession with taking a peek into the harem, and attempting to understand whether or not Muslim women are, in fact, oppressed. The secret sex lives of barbaric Muslim men and their oppressed wives is not a relic of a Colonial past, but still something that continues to enthrall us today. In 2008, Naomi Wolf wrote about the secret world "behind the veil", where she gave a glance into the supposed secret sexual lives of Muslim women. After interviewing Muslim women in a couple of countries, Wolf gushes about an exotic and tantalising world of Muslim women —- who also enjoy beauty products and sex. Shocker." "So, why are countries with really high percentages of Muslims googling "sex"? It might be a lack of access or education, it might be conservative values —- but this ultimately relies on the community and country. With 2.2 billion Muslims out there, the way in which religion is practiced in different countries not only makes it unhelpful to generalize —- it is also inaccurate. Maybe this isn't as much about Islam in itself, as it is about societies with more public conservative values, a problem that isn't exclusive to the so-called Muslim world."
  22. sundayschool

    Hijab: A Male Perspective

    According to a study, the overwhelming majority of literature for Muslim women is on modest dress/Hijab. Now, this topic is very important, but it's gotten to the point that it's almost exclusively the only topic that is discussed in relation to Muslim women! People talk so much about how the "West" (as if it's a monolithic entity) only values women for how they look...I can't help but think that Muslims are falling into the same trap by repeating the same issue ad nauseum. Everyday it seems that someone decides to offer a "fresh" or "new" perspective on Hijab...because the 200 million other articles apparently don't do it enough justice. Now, I'm not saying that this is not a topic unworthy of discussion. It is, very much so. But I, for one, would like to read more about other women's issues! I'd like to read more about work-life balance in a Muslim family, one that goes beyond "a woman's first duty is in the home," and actually discusses the complexities of being being a working mother. I'd like to read about how to maintain a loving relationship with your parents, even if they're getting on your last nerve. I'd like to see something about remaining confident even while you're constantly being told by the media that you're not smart enough, you're not pretty enough, you're not skinny enough. I'd like to read articles that focus more on domestic abuse and how to escape your violent husband/in-laws. Muslims often talk about how the Hijab can function as a liberating force. But when that's all you talk about, like it's the only thing that matters for a Muslim woman, it can be quite repressive, actually. We're not just bodies that need to be covered.
  23. sundayschool

    Migration: a few kinks

    So that's what happened! Probably for the best. I never got a chance to read your replies. Maybe one day I'll be brave and revisit the topic...but not today.